2009-12-23 -- Draft: How Would You Rate Zendikar Commons?

[icky3499]

By all means take the nighthawk.  I think that's what mrrstn mentioned in his post and I totally agree with him.

Priority is to get cards that will help you build a decent deck.  Counterdraft as a last resort.  Taking a Nighthawk early just because you don't want anyone to get hold of it (AKA counterdrafting) is not a good strategy if there is another playable card for your deck.

Actually if you pass something like the nighthawk, you are sending a very good signal to your neighbor to go black.  It's just a disaster if players seated next to you are drafting similar colors.  Be good to thy neighbor and you shall be rewarded.

[cmdrjanjalani]

So what if the colored dried up? Hate draft is the only way to go, you had your signals that the one your passing to is drafting black, and then you see the nighthawk, the only white card in there is caravan hurda, which for me is 13th pick(personal preference), I'd take the nighthawk anytime of the day, am I an a-hole for taking the nigthawk?

It's really up to you. Aside from hate drafting, you can splash it (Nighthawk is that good) if you have enough fixers, but if you could also opt for the win-win situation with your draft seatmate. Malay mo he will thank you for the Nighthawk by shipping Shepherd of the Lost or Journey to Nowhere diba? If you screw his draft, baka he will opt for another color at malay mo makipagawan pa kayo sa white. Things happen and there is no clear answer to this one.

@xalwynx
If you are just playing an ordinary draft, most of the time the reward is a couple of packs that may contain good cards. So what would choose, the 700 pesos staring at your face or passing it (making your opponent very very happy) for a chance that you may win 700 pesos? Take note that most of the time the prize packs come from the same box so the fact that you cracked open a fetch lessens the chance that if you did win, that you would get something to cover the card you passed. I'm not saying you're stupid if you pass a money rare, but I guess I'd rather get the prize that is already staring at me in the face. Sa high-stakes tourney lang siguro ko kaya magpasa ng uber-money cards, but I can slide off a 200 peso rare kung maganda ang ibang pick ko. Or you can propose rare pool.

Huwag ka lang maiyak parang yung kilala ko na nakabukas ng Baneslayer sa 3rd pack niya on a rare pool M10 draft. And lost the last round to a 50-peso rare (stupid Ant Queen.)

[ramonvelasquez]

Huwag ka lang maiyak parang yung kilala ko na nakabukas ng Baneslayer sa 3rd pack niya on a rare pool M10 draft. And lost the last round to a 50-peso rare (stupid Ant Queen.)

Si morris ba to? lol

[jigz]

i don't understand why counterdrafting as a strategy is perceived negatively when it's one skill you have to learn along with the others, i.e. signalling, forcing, etc.

i don't counterdraft when it's a casual draft (e.g. online, 43s, fnm) but i always consider it at different points of the draft when i need to win that particular draft

recent example is the last ptq, first pack i had 4 black cards and was passed devout lightcaster and hagra crocodile. i knew i was going mono or heavy black and i therefore had to consider the effect that lightcaster would have in my chances of getting the invite. yes the probability of actually facing the card was small, but not zero, what if i faced it in game 3 of the finals? the counterdraft was easy since the alternate choice was only the croc, but what if it was a surrakar? lacerator? what if the lightcaster was in your third pack with you only needing 4 cards to fill out your deck, you'd pass it over disfigure and hideous end but would you pass it over surrakar (again, i love that guy) or crypt ripper (who could table)?

magic has evolved, while old school thinking requires you to dismiss counterdrafting, i think present day drafting requires you to at least consider it every step of the way

as for being friendly to your neighbours, i suggest you make sure you know the players to your left (and right), it pays to feed some players and just useless with others (not a general group btw, just some specific persons, you know who you are   )

edit: off the top of my head pick order (* means goes up in certain archetypes)

1.   Hideous End
2.   Disfigure
3.   Surrakar Marauder
4.   Vampire Lacerator
5.   Giant Scorpion
6.   Nimana Sell-Sword*
7.   Crypt Ripper*
8.   Blood Seeker
9.   Heartstabber Mosquito
10.   Soulstair Expedition
11.   Hagra Crocodile
12.   Guul Draz Vampire*
13.   Vampire’s Bite
14.   Grim Discovery
15.   Mindless Null
16.   Bog Tatters
17.   Piranha Marsh
18.   Desecrated Earth
19.   Mire Blight

1.   Burst Lightning
2.   Plated Geopede
3.   Bladetusk Boar
4.   Goblin Shortcutter
5.   Shatterskull Giant
6.   Torch Slinger
7.   Highland Berserker
8.   Magma Rift
9.   Spire Barrage*
10.   Tuktuk Grunts
11.   Zektar Shrine Expedition*
12.   Goblin War Paint
13.   Molten Ravager*
14.   Goblin Bushwhacker
15.   Slaughter Cry
16.   Seismic Shudder
17.   Teetering Peaks
18.   Ruinous Minotaur
19.   Demolish

1.   Oran Rief Survivalist
2.   Grazing Gladeheart
3.   Timbermaw Larva
4.   Nissa’s Chosen
5.   Mold Shambler
6.   Vines of Vastwood
7.   Harrow
8.   Territorial Baloth
9.   Savage Silhoutte
10.   Oran Rief Recluse
11.           Khalni Heart Expedition
12.   Soaring Seacliff
13.   Craptastic

1.   Journey to Nowhere
2.   Kor Skyfisher
3.   Kor Hookmaster
4.   Steppe Lynx
5.   Kor Sanctifiers
6.   Kor Cartographer
7.   Cliff Threader
8.   Kor Outfitter
9.   Ondu Cleric*
10.   Malakindi Shieldmate*
11.   Narrow Escape
12.   Nimbus Wings
13.   Kabira Crossroads
14.   Shieldmate’s Blessing
15.   Pillarfield Ox
16.   Bold Defense
17.   Noble Vestige
18.   Caravan Hurda
19.   Sunspring Expedition

1.   Umara Raptor
2.   Welkin Tern
3.   Windrider Eel*
4.   Into the Roil
5.   Whiplash Trap
6.   Kraken Hatchling
7.   Reckless Scholar
8.   Paralyzing Grasp
9.   Spreading Seas
10.   Ior Ruin Expedition
11.   Sky Ruin Drake
12.   Cancel
13.   Tempest Owl
14.   Lethargy Trap
15.   Spell Pierce
16.   Shoal Serpent
17.   Caller of Gales
18.   Trapfinder’s Trick

[mrrstn]

Huwag ka lang maiyak parang yung kilala ko na nakabukas ng Baneslayer sa 3rd pack niya on a rare pool M10 draft. And lost the last round to a 50-peso rare (stupid Ant Queen.)

Si morris ba to? lol

wah oo ako nga! at ano naman ba ang magagawa ng baneslayer sa ant queen na naka armored ascension? lol ayun nung rarepool na, kinuha ko sa dulo yung ant queen sabay punit lol stupid ant queen! 

[singer_from_sengir]

Hate drafting is a legitimate strategy and should not be frowned upon. It is employed by the pros and if we don't adapt, we will end up being left behind. However, there are still important factors to consider like how powerful is the hated card against you or how detrimental to your strategy is hate drafting like for example.

I have drafted u-g landfall deck witha oracle of mul daya, rites of replication, baloth woodcrasher and the works. Unfortunately, I only had 1 greenweaver druid to accelerate into my fantastic cards. In the last pack I got passed an 2nd pick vampire nighthawk and harrow. I picked the harrow and ended up going 3-0 in the draft pod.

[singer_from_sengir]

The draft picks posted in the article should only serve as a guide for difficult picks  and not as a drafting manual. As was commented, the picks are interchangeable and could also depends on the player's drafting preferences and archetype being drafted.

[jaytyah]

surrakar (again, i love that guy)

What's a surrakar?

[xalwynx]

surrakar (again, i love that guy)

What's a surrakar?

Surrakar Marauder

[mrrstn]

surrakar (again, i love that guy)

What's a surrakar?

Surrakar Marauder

Dude its a private joke. Better tell that to Mark Rivera lol

[xalwynx]

oh lol. haha

[galemazuma]

Posting in behalf of mr. taong_gagamba..

1) How many drafts did you have before you manage to derive the chart?

hi Miro, sorry I should have mentioned in the article.
Based 'to sa kakapanood ng drafts in Melbourne shops (as I mentioned I was exiled).
pag Wednesday, they can have as many as eight 8-player drafts sa isang shop (metagames.com.au).
minsan pag OFW ka and away from family, marami kang oras so yeah nagtrip lang ako tinally ko lahat yun and came out with this order.
as i said in the article, "This is no way the best pick order. It is based on what many people think how they should draft Zendikar"
it is possible that the pick order is influenced by the players preferences and playing styles here ::shrugs::
as for my own personal pick order, i'll post it later.

I don't agree .. lost interest .. laughing .. too highly .. don't underestimate..

Well, I agree with you cmdrjanjalani. Gulat ka no Yes tama ka. And I know you are a drafter because you know how to grade cards to some degree.
Anyways those in the draft guide are not my picks. If you read the article, I would draft differently from what is in the draft guide.
Ang puso mo

mas gusto ko kung c jt porter gagawa ng article about this subject.. no offense..

no offense taken
well actually ako din arki. i wanna see idol porter's picks and yours as well.
i always look at other picks and i found it different for every other good drafter.
pag picks ko lang ako magrerely and magstay that way, i will  not improve.
that's why you have to learn from others din.

@ taong_gagamba, while I may not agree on some of the pick orders(iba kasi yung nakagisnan kong strategy sa ZZZ draft hehe), nice article nonetheless. keep 'em coming.
btw, pano mo ginawa yung jpg file mo? isa isa pinagpatong mo yung cards tapos screenshot??? adik hehe

thanks mrrstn! and yes i'm adik enough (and bored) para pagtyagaan yang jpg na yan. excel, gatherer, wholla!

@TS Nice article, though i'm not particularly experienced in drafting, I liked the idea that more people are encouraged to pass articles for us to read

thanks kishindouji! more unsolicited advice coming in the next few weeks (whether you like it.. or else! hehe).
not only from me, but also from others who would like to pitch in.

edit: off the top of my head pick order (* means goes up in certain archetypes)

i like jigz' post. it's constructive and definitely something i want to experiment on.
nice work jigz!

The draft picks posted in the article should only serve as a guide for difficult picks  and not as a drafting manual. As was commented, the picks are interchangeable and could also depends on the player's drafting preferences and archetype being drafted.

natumbok mo pre!
wait.. kilala kita! biased ka eh magkilala tayo eh
haha

[galemazuma]

Here are the author's picks.
Note that for me the deck archetype is more important than the draft guide.

Hideous End
Disfigure
Giant Scorpion (doubles as mini removal)
Vampire Lacerator (i like aggro)
Nimana Sell-Sword
Guul Draz Vampire (evasion late game)
Surrakar Marauder
Heartstabber Mosquito (higher if paired with green)
Crypt Ripper (much much higher pick if monoblack or Bx)
Blood Seeker
Soulstair Expedition (not a fan, but will use it)
Grim Discovery (higher pick if may fetchlands.. rare)
Vampire’s Bite (slightly higher pick if looking to deal 10dam fast)
Hagra Crocodile (don't like the can't block part, maybe hate draft)
Bog Tatters (won't maindeck but will side in 1 against slow black decks, will hate draft if drafting black)

Burst Lightning
Plated Geopede
Bladetusk Boar
Highland Berserker (next to aggro, likes allies)
Torch Slinger
Shatterskull Giant (slightly lower pick if red not main color)
Goblin Shortcutter
Magma Rift (higher pick if land-heavy deck, lower pick if aggro tempo deck)
Spire Barrage (higher pick if monored or Rx)
Tuktuk Grunts (used to draft this high but there are other better 5cc in that slot)
Zektar Shrine Expedition (used to draft this kasi aggro lover, pero masyadong conditional, better kung multiple copies)
Teetering Peaks
Goblin War Paint
Goblin Bushwhacker
Molten Ravager (higher if monored, but will not draft more than 1
Slaughter Cry (higher if low in removals)
Ruinous Minotaur (used to draft this highly until i keep losing lands and games coz opponent keeps on taking the first attack)

Oran Rief Survivalist
Nissa’s Chosen (much lower if green is not main color)
Grazing Gladeheart
Harrow (lower if mono or Gx)
Mold Shambler
Vines of Vastwood
Territorial Baloth
Timbermaw Larva (higher if heavy green deck)
Khalni Heart Expedition
Oran Rief Recluse
Savage Silhoutte (low in my picks but won me some games)
Turntimber Grove

Journey to Nowhere
Kor Skyfisher
Kor Hookmaster
Kor Sanctifiers
Kor Cartographer
Steppe Lynx
Pillarfield Ox (low in most ppl's picks)
Cliff Threader
Ondu Cleric (higher if allies deck)
Malakindi Shieldmate
Bold Defense

Windrider Eel
Umara Raptor
Welkin Tern
Whiplash Trap
Paralyzing Grasp
Into the Roil
Reckless Scholar
Sky Ruin Drake
Ior Ruin Expedition
Soaring Seacliff
Spell Pierce
Cancel
Shoal Serpent

Sabi sa isang "Choose Your Own Adventure" book ko nung bata ako: BELIEVE ONLY HALF OF WHAT YOU READ
Sa mga nahirapan makagets, it means "believe what you believe is right, discard what goes against your principles, and be open to the rest"
So kahit sa article ko I would expect the same for you guys. Don't believe everything I say

Aim high. And no misplays.

[galemazuma]

wento lang...
nung Regionals 2002 draft, katabi ko si Feleo. then after the draft tinanong nya ako anong ginawa ko bakit ganun. sabi ko ay sorry first time ko eh.
hehe!
sorry Feleo. natalo mo naman ako first round eh

anways binigyan nya ako ng advise after the first draft which i took to heart.
went 1-2 the first draft, but went 2-1 the second draft because i began picking better cards.

[cmdrjanjalani]

@galemazuma

Well, great to know that was not your personal chart. To be honest beyond the first few picks it goes downhill. If this chart was created based on a group of people's picks, I guess a lot of bad drafters made it go wonky down the 5th or 6th pick.

Would have been nice to have the author's personal picks on the article though, since he already posted them here. And looks like it's much, much better than the "guide" which is really weak.